Suquoya Tyler (00:00):
I just wanna say too I think everyone walking this planet has a SIM codependency in them And if they say they don’t they they just haven’t acknowledged it yet…
Christopher Bruce (00:15):
Hi everyone I’m Chris Bruce South Florida divorce attorney and I have the absolute pleasure today of being joined by Sequoia Tyler Sequoia is a LMHC She has an office in Palm Beach Gardens Florida she services clients across the state of Florida virtually and I had the unique opportunity to watch Sequoia give a presentation about a month ago on women’s empowerment and navigating life changes and that fits so well together with Sequoia’s main practice areas which are codependency dealing with self esteem issues and trauma and anxiety And I was really excited when she agreed to come on today and talk about co dependency and navigating co dependency It’s something that I see a lot of women struggle with It can hold them back in their relationships and just being happy and healthy people So Koya thank you so much for for coming on and maybe tell the viewers a little bit about yourself and we’ll get into it here.
Suquoya Tyler (01:18):
Yeah Thank you Thank you so much for having me I’m super excited to to be here and talk to you and talk about codependency so I’ve been a clinician for almost ten years now Next year will be ten years which when I say is like say it out loud is crazy but it’s been almost ten years. And I’ve I’ve had the pleasure of working in various settings and populations. I’ve worked with kiddos and adults who struggle with, symptoms of trauma, struggle with codependency self esteem anxiety, impression I’ve worked in like treatment settings. I’ve worked in group home settings I’ve worked in jail settings so I’ve got I’ve I’ve kind of been all over the board…with who I work with but that’s I I there’s not really anything I haven’t heard or seen in my career So I’ve been very blessed and fortunate to work with just lots of people I’ve also… gone through my own therapy I always think it’s important for like people to know that therapists go to therapy, because we’re humans too and our pants on the same way everyone else does Right So…I’m I’ve been a client still am a client sometimes and big advocate for this work So that’s me in a nutshell as far as clinical work.
Christopher Bruce (02:44):
And thank you again for being part of this and it was really cool to watch the presentation you did to a roomful of people I guess two months ago now that let’s get into the the topic, understanding…codependency and I mean in in maybe even some of my my attorneys kinda misunderstand…what codependency actually means sometimes so if you don’t mind Sequoia, maybe take us through what is codependency and how can somebody recognize if maybe they’re dealing with it?
Suquoya Tyler (03:21):
So I always describe codependency It’s just kind of like… putting placing anyone’s needs values worth above your own And that can take on like various forms There’s there’s no like cookie cutter way So…I always just say if you feel like you’re doing something you don’t wanna do or if you’re holding back because you’re afraid to rock the boat with someone else or just diff it looks different but basically putting the needs wants and worth…of someone else over your own That’s kinda what total dependency is. so yeah…
Christopher Bruce (04:00):
So and I guess just as a a follow-up on on that Like I’ve heard, people joke like, Hey I really like being with my spouse We’re inseparable usually NA like I love love my husband or or wife kind of wait Is that codependency Or are we talking about something a little bit different?
Suquoya Tyler (04:20):
So it’s funny I had a client actually just talked to me about this Like she was telling me how…she and her partner are joint at the hip Like they do everything together like when they have a day of separation they are like they’re attitudes change Like they kinda interact different. And so I think that if you find yourself attached at the hip, that’s probably a a codependent relationship because the goal of relationships is to be interdependent. Right Like so that means I I love hanging out with you I can spend time with you and it’s great. And I can be by myself I can do my own thing I can have a girls night You can have a guys night Right Like we can also function as to individuals right If you find yourself feeling like… anxious or constantly worried or preoccupied with thoughts about your partner when you guys are separated, it’s probably a telltale sign that you are codependent…
Christopher Bruce (05:21):
Gotcha Hold on Here’s that Oh so for people who are codependent, why why is it a problem How does it how does it affect somebody…
Suquoya Tyler (05:33):
That’s a good question So I think it’s a problem I’ve I just wanna say too I think everyone walking this planet has just some codependency in them And if they say they don’t they they just haven’t acknowledged it yet…so I think codependency can be an issue because of what it is You’re replacing someone’s needs and values and worth over your own And so you are not honoring how you feel You’re not honoring what you wanna do. and you are not being authentic You’re not being real You’re not being who you are And I think personally… the goal in life is to live happy and authentic right and have true happiness not external happiness but like happiness from within And I don’t think you can achieve that if you’re putting the worth of someone else over over you Right Because then you’re not filling your own cup up You’re too busy filling everybody else’s cup…
Christopher Bruce (06:32):
That makes a lot of that makes a lot of sense I mean just to hear my my son the other day talking about I guess at schools I talk about filling up each other’s buckets but filling up their own and it kinda sounds like maybe that’s a little bit of what you’re talking about here…
Suquoya Tyler (06:46):
Yeah Because if you’re so good no else is good Right Like you can’t no one around you can be good if you’re not good Right Like how can you pour into other people’s cups or buckets if yours is empty…
Christopher Bruce (07:00):
So where does this come from How does codependency develop in somebody…
Suquoya Tyler (07:07):
I would say usually in trauma some type of trauma you experience and I think that…at the root of it all at the root of all codependency is like a negative core belief which is a deeply held belief that…we develop usually in childhood or when we experience some type of trauma. And the two most common…negative core beliefs are I don’t matter and I’m not good enough. And if you’re operating in the world with these two core beliefs one both whatever, then you constantly have this like need to…matter right or be good enough And so you are constantly seeking like external things or trying to be this person that maybe you’re really not, to…dispel those beliefs…And really the only way you can is by looking inside and challenging those beliefs But I think a lot of times people experience trauma and it alters how they view the world and it alters how they function with people because they’re looking at people and the world through the lens of their core belief So if you have this, you know, I don’t matter belief then you probably are gonna be may maybe be avoided in you know a relationship I think a lot of times think like if you’re codependent and you’re anxious but I you can also be avoidant and codependent. Right Because you pull away, and it’s almost like you have this need for like your partner to be like well what’s wrong you know and and try to figure out what’s going on So the long answer that I just gave is essentially trauma. Trauma is I think the biggest cause of like, codependency…
Christopher Bruce (08:53):
There’s somebody who’s listening to this and they’re thinking hey maybe I’m checking some of the boxes here I might be codependent and I don’t like the way that is affecting my life. and they wanna try to break free from some of that Do you have any advice on what those people might try to start doing?
Suquoya Tyler (09:17):
So the the best way to combat co dependency and it’s it’s a word that we hear I think often especially nowadays but it’s it’s a lot easier said than done. And that word is boundaries. Right Like having boundaries and boundaries are like limits or guidelines that people put in place to protect themselves but also to contain themselves Right So you’re not imposing your beliefs or your wants or needs onto someone else but you’re also keeping some space in between you and other people so that you can protect yourself.
so boundaries saying no right letting letting your nose be nose and your yays VA is being assertive right having really assertive effective communication, not being too passive or aggressive But just being very direct with your boundaries and like holding firm on those boundaries Right So like saying no and like letting that know…be no…
So boundaries boundaries boundaries boundaries…
Christopher Bruce (10:21):
Do people who might have some of the codependent trades Do they is self esteem an issue with them also?
Suquoya Tyler (10:29):
I would definitely say so I think any I think if you’re willing to place the needs, and value and worth of someone else over your own To me that probably means that you are struggling with your own worth and needs and values which to me equates to like a lower self esteem…
Christopher Bruce (10:53):
It’s one of the things just the trends I see in my law practice with you know people who are in usually difficult relationships that might have some of these codependent type traits Ultimately it it’s at least my impression is they feel like they don’t deserve to be treated a certain way which I mean for for me it’s just it’s sad to see Everybody has a you know should be happy and feel that they deserve to be happy but maybe it’s for those types of people that don’t think maybe…they deserve to to be treated well Do you have any advice for them on how they might start working to change that belief…
Suquoya Tyler (11:35):
Well one I would say go to therapy. Yes Number one. Yes Go to therapy I think that you you know it’s…it’s something that you have to unpack like how you got there I think in order to fix something you gotta understand where the problem lies And so I think you gotta go to therapy You gotta unpack your trauma. You gotta challenge your beliefs and your your views and your perception and you have to give yourself permission to challenge those things Permission to change your mentality I think a lot of us get like really stuck in seeing things one way because that’s just the way it’s been and that’s how That’s what I’m used to That’s what’s familiar. and I think you really have to give yourself…permission to…change your change your mindset change your mentality challenge your beliefs.
I think honestly though, It it’s really difficult to…it’s really difficult to challenge or to improve your self esteem I think without understanding where your self esteem became low. so I think the therapy honestly I think go to therapy, unpack your trauma unpack the things you’ve been through, unlearn certain habits and and certain…ways of thinking and relearn new ways of thinking and relearn ways of of looking at yourself. You know…
Christopher Bruce (13:04):
I mean, from and maybe you could shed some light on this I know therapy can be kinda like a divorce It can be a little different for everyone But are we like talking about a ten year odyssey to start making progress on yourself here or how long does it take to start…
Suquoya Tyler (13:18):
Absolutely Not It doesn’t take a ten year odyssey Honestly it takes however long…you you allow it to take So some people come in and hit the ground running They’re like I can’t live like this anymore I need to change and they are willing and open to try…anything I throw at them Like they’re like, you know just throw it at me I’ll try it I’m willing to try it Other people I think are a little bit more resistant They’re a little bit more hesitant to try new things It’s uncomfortable you know there’s still a little iffy. Which is fine but I think that prolongs the process because part of the work is opening yourself up and, you know surrendering to the therapy process and which means allowing your therapist to…guide you and lead you and and show you new things and teach unique things and you being willing to implement them Right But if we’re spending time getting you to a point to open up to try new things that’s gonna take a little bit longer than the person that’s coming in and it’s like whatever you wanna do I’ll do it You know Like just just help me…
Christopher Bruce (14:27):
Well that makes a lot of sense And I mean it’s so that’s that’s what I I tell our clients some people I think the views are starting to change you know in the same age but I think some people think oh what’s gonna take like a year before I make any progress I was like no If you go get a results driven therapist and you’re motivated and you do your homework which probably after battle you’re gonna probably see some real gains very quickly so that’s…
hear that Now today, I’ve heard, that there’s different groups for for certain types of people who are looking to kind of you know make make life…changes it for people with codependent traits is is is group therapy a thing or not so much?
Suquoya Tyler (15:11):
Yeah There’s actually a group It’s Coda which I think it’s been a while since I’ve researched it but it’s codependency anonymous if I remember correct…I think yeah there’s coded groups that you can research online You can do virtual groups or in some areas depending on where you are there are in person options I think they’re mostly virtual. But there are groups like centered around codependency for sure. Right. And I think they’re good I actually sorry I don’t mean to cut you off. Oh yeah.
But I think group is good and because I think that you know when you’re in therapy you have your therapist telling you all this stuff But when you’re in a group you not only have a therapist but you also have peers that you know are there to call things out or challenge you or relate to you so I think group therapy is is a wonderful option for individuals that are struggling with codependency…
Christopher Bruce (16:19):
I guess random question here It’s kind of maybe not on the the script but I’ve always seen when I I’ve seen people that in my law practice some of the divorce lawyer I think as you’re aware a lot of our clients are kind of associate with being married usually to a husband that doesn’t treat them like sometimes they’re narcissists maybe they’re just a difficult person. It’s like when I see a lot of people in my world that I would maybe say are checking some of the co dependent trade boxes Usually their their husband is somebody to divorce at the end of the day It was to my mind But somebody’s listening to this and they’re identifying maybe they’re in the co dependent side of of, the ledger so to speak Does that mean that it’s their partner that’s causing the issues or can it just be maybe something individual to the the person and they’re in an otherwise…healthy marriage…
Suquoya Tyler (17:16):
So meaning like is the partner causing the codependency?
Christopher Bruce (17:20):
Yeah Yeah Because I don’t want people to listen to this and think oh it’s all my husband’s fault And you know I have a marriage that could otherwise you know be improved come apart…
Suquoya Tyler (17:30):
Yeah Yeah That’s actually a really great question And I think people might not like the answer but no. It’s not a partner issue It’s a you issue it’s something that it not to say the partner doesn’t contribute. Right I think that’s definitely a contributing factor Your your partner and your partner’s personality and what they bring into the relationship but I definitely think that codependency is an individual issue that has to be worked on Right because, I mean think about it If you are…I don’t know constantly willing to take on the burden of your husband financially. Right…You started doing that Right So now when your husband is like, I’m not doing it You’ve been doing it Right Like that’s not a partner thing You you have been doing it Right You kinda set the scene for this And Right It might not have been something you actually wanted to do Maybe you agreed to it to like I don’t know make him be quiet or…make, you know stabilize the relationship whatever reason…you decided to do it That was your decision Right So like that was your decision to be codependent in that moment. and so that’s something you have to work on…
Christopher Bruce (18:49):
It’s interesting Yeah That popped into my head as we’re going through this because I usually see it as okay Well the person’s married to a, you know a monster sometimes I mean it’s just my the people I meet are they’re like it’s a small pool Like they’re usually people that have marital issues I know that there’s other people that are different in the world. But that I like what you’re saying I mean to me that that part is probably something I’m gonna be a little bit more proactive in telling our clients like hey yeah this is the relationship but you know you got you gotta work on yourself here and and that’s how you’re gonna get the the improvement in in the life going forward So that’s pretty cool Thanks for taking any off the script question there…So for maybe somebody that’s listening to this and they’re like hey you know Sequoia is talking about my sister or my daughter. And they they’re a family a loved one maybe a girlfriend and they wanna try to be as supportive as possible and and helping that other person who might be codependent make some positive life changes Do you have any advice for them on how to approach that issue and and be as helpful as they can…
Suquoya Tyler (20:02):
Yeah So I would say first encourage them to go to therapy. Yeah Encourage them to go to therapy because it’s super helpful. I would also say encourage them to…hold their boundaries and call them out respectfully lovingly caringly when they are not honoring those boundaries You know I think it’s very easy for us to kinda slip back into old habits. and so having accountability having someone there to be like, hey Sequoia you said no Like, remember like we’re we’re we’re holding boundaries here so your no needs to be a no and that’s it You know just kinda holding people accountable your your loved ones accountable for what they want and what they say they’re working on you know not being afraid to call them out not being afraid to point out when they are slipping back into old patterns…I think that’s…probably the best thing that you can do for them is help hold them accountable, and encourage them to go to therapy…and just be supportive you know just be supportive give them some grace They’re not gonna be perfect. we’re no one’s perfect and we all slip back into old habits I definitely do even as a therapist So I think be supportive give them grace but but don’t be afraid to call them out and be assertive and and hold them accountable.
Christopher Bruce (21:26):
People who are codependent, and they’re realizing this at a point where maybe they’re also realizing it’s it’s the end of their marriage and it might be going through a a divorce from a…difficult person Do you have any advice for those people as they approach the divorce then maybe get into one with you know, what might be some still present codependent traits…
Suquoya Tyler (21:56):
I would say, I know I keep saying therapy but therapy therapy therapy
Christopher Bruce (22:02):
I’d say that That would be do it all before That’s my best ice but to tell you what you would say…
Suquoya Tyler (22:09):
Yeah I think being in therapy for sure even as you approach…the possible divorce is important I think also…
being gentle with yourself you know like, you’re already going through a hard time and I think we get caught in this loop of thinking where it’s like really negative. and we’re talking to ourselves internally really negative and we’re not really treating ourselves the best So I would just say you know outside of going to therapy and doing your work and really understanding and learning yourself…give yourself some grace this it’s not an easy thing to get a divorce It’s not, you’re not gonna be perfect You’re not gonna do everything right So you know be nice to yourself. Be nice to yourself and go to therapy. that’s probably the two most important things I think you can do…
Christopher Bruce (23:04):
And you know we’ve lot of I think really awesome stuff we’ve covered here And you know do you have any other advice for somebody that’s that’s listening to this and saying hey…
Suquoya Tyler (23:18):
I would say that’s a good question What would I say I would say again be nice to yourself and give yourself grace. I would say this too shall pass Right Like nothing lasts forever and you might be in a storm right now but it’s not gonna last forever. You will get through it if you want to get through it Right Like if you wanna do something you will do it So I think you know, give yourself time give yourself grace, pour all the energy and effort into yourself and learning yourself and challenging all of those negative beliefs unlearning some of those maladaptive behaviors like codependency
Christopher Bruce (23:55):
so where before we go if can just tell everybody how do they get in touch with you How do they go through possibly becoming your clients so that they can reach out if they’d like to…
Suquoya Tyler (24:09):
So you can reach out to me via email That’s probably the easiest So I have a group practice that I work with and I also have my own solo practice. so with the group practice the email is my first name So sequoia at hearing therapists s at the end Therapist has an s at the end It’s plural of broward dot com It’s super long. It’s just one of those things So it’s sequoia at caring therapist of broward dot com You can also go on caring therapists at broward dot com on the site and you’ll find the the information to get in touch with the office So the phone number and the the office email that’s also a good way to get in in contact. I would encourage clients who like have insurance to go that route for those that don’t necessarily want to use insurance then I usually send them to my solo practice which is authentically you counseling and wellness, And so that email is my first name again sequoia at authentically you counseling dot com. And the you and the email is an actual letter u not y o u That’s important to note…
Christopher Bruce (25:23):
And for everybody watching we’ll have this in the show notes the podcast the YouTube and social media descriptions so it’s all right there Sequoia, thank you so much for being part of this I’ve gotten to see you speak now. Twice I encourage anybody who might have anything in in the realm of codependency trauma just working on self esteem being a happier person to reach out to Sequoia she knows what she’s talking about and it’s just awesome to be around you So thank you for being part of this.
Suquoya Tyler (25:58):
Thank you Thank you so much for having me If you ever need me to come back I’m happy to I appreciate the work you and Ashley do So I’m always here if you need me.
